Sick Fish

[PaulineMi]

I seem to have inadvertently spread something to or from some tanks.  I use separate syphons on 5 of my 6 tanks. Everything gets HOT water and hydrogen peroxide run through it between uses. Here's what I have going on:

90 gallon discus tank:
1..An electric blue ram darkened and subsequently died in a hospital tank
2..A discus with HITH who is well on his way to recovery in his hospital tank
3..A discus who looked vaguely punky that is appearing recovered in a hospital tank

75 gallon angel tank:
4.. A diamond tetra swimming erratically then died
5..A beautiful pinoy paraiba veil laying on its side in a hospital tank.  Euthanasia when I finish this post. 

No new fish, no changes in procedures but I obviously did something.  We're on well water so no city water treatment issues.

[Mugwump]

I'm sorry to hear that, Pauline...
If nothing new has been brought in, then perhaps a few are just genetically weaker and then get sick and/or die......any live foods?? ..... sometimes they just aren't as hearty as they look...?

[wsantia1]

I'm sorry about your losses Pauline.  I hope it was just a few weak ones like Jon said.  You have beautiful fish and hopefully you keep what ever it is from spreading.

[PaulineMi]

No...not even new or changed foods.  I attributed the blue ram's death to the stress of aggression from another spawning pair. I did stir up some mulm in the sump that flowed into the tank but cleaned it up immediately and even ran the UV sterilizer. The discus that are in the hospital tank seem to be doing fine. They even started coming to the front of the tank for food. (Fingers crossed that we keep heading in this direction.)

My "Carol's Angels" tank has me stumped. That tank is in the family room so I can't imagine what caused the deaths of the two fish in there. The pinoy paraiba was one of the most beautiful angels I've ever owned.

The "Jon's Angels" tank and the Dantums........so far so good. 

Guess I just needed to vent.  In the meantime water changes, water changes, water changes instead of "just" two or three per week. 

[PaulineMi]

Thanks Willie.

[PaulineMi]

I know how I'd answer this question if someone else asked it....but I have to ask:

Once a fish is laying on its side on the bottom of the tank it's essentially over for it...correct? Time to be put out of its misery even if it looks like it's trying to survive....   

[Mugwump]

Sorry to say but ..yes...even if they get going again for a day..it's usually over...but...look for spawn battle wounds..if they just took a good hit, sometimes moving them will bring them around...I've had a few of those over the years....

[PaulineMi]

Thanks Jon.  And I don't think a spawn body slam occurred. These are the most unbelievably mellow angels I've ever had.

[Barb]

Hi Pauline, sorry to hear you are having issues.  But after reading through your posts, I don't think it is a disease, virus, bacterial, etc going on rampantly.  If just a few fish, I wouldn't worry too much for now.  Just do large wc;s, I think a good one every other day,   The few fish you have lost or who are ill are so few.  If you had a big problem like "discus or angel plague" as some call them,  then I think you would have most fish sick or starting to act bad.  Your beautiful angel may have been old, or had an internal problem you didn't know about, could be lots of things.  No need to medicate tanks now, just keep an eye on them.  And keep reporting back here?
Barb

[PaulineMi]

Thank you Barb. The angel is a year old or so.  I had it since it was a baby. All its tankmates are fine. A pair are even spawning right now. I'm not medicating tanks as all the fish appear fine.

I'll post updates. 

[BillT]

Sorry to hear about this Pauline,

These are some possibilities that occur to me:

1) Its been cold where you are. This always makes me think of possible gas supersaturation due to cold water containing lots of dissolved gas being heated up and then used before it could lose the excess gas. Have no idea if that might have happened with your set-up. Symptoms of this are often fish are at the bottom of the tanks trying to get to greater pressure.

2) You stirred up stuff in the sump which got into the one or more tanks. There might have been something infectious in the sump which got through your UV on the stirred up particles (they can shade pathogens from the UV). The fix for this is to put a particle filter before the UV.

3) If the stuff in the sump had a bunch of fungus, the fungus can produce toxins that can rapidly affect fish. I am guessing probably not on this one.

It sounds like this is a small proportion of your fish which would rule out general bad stuff in the water that one would expect to affect many fish.

Your siphon care sounds great by the way.

[PaulineMi]

Thanks Bill.  I age the water for the discus and the angels in the back room.  The angels in the family room get un-aged water.  The "sick" angel was the only one at the bottom.  It had been at the top of the tank earlier. Perhaps it was more sensitive?  I use a hose nozzle on a setting that churns the water to help prevent gas but who knows?

The sump is only on the discus tank.  It's actually there so to provide additional water for the tank.  I have HMF filtration in that tank.  However there is a pre-filter sleeve in the overflow box, filter floss in the first section of the sump which is separated from next two sections of the sump by Poret foam. There is a type of bio-balls in the center section of the sump.  Those are what I move around and caused mulm to flow out into the tank.  The UV is in the sump so your theory is a possibility.  Luckily the discus that got sick are well on their way to recovery.

Stuff happens....darn it.  Now it's back to taking the best care possible of the healthy ones.

[b125killer]

Sorry to hear about your fish. I  know it doesn't take much for the rams. Looking at them funny will kill it. I hope it's nothing serious. 

[PaulineMi]

Thanks Scott. 

I swore never to get rams again due to how delicate they are but I broke down and got these..  The pair in the discus tank spawn regularly and I so want to put them in their own tank. I'd love trying to have them raise a spawn. However "don't mess with success" keeps coming to mind. I'm afraid if I move them they'll die.   

[Mugwump]

Thanks Scott. 

I swore never to get rams again due to how delicate they are but I broke down and got these..  The pair in the discus tank spawn regularly and I so want to put them in their own tank. I'd love trying to have them raise a spawn. However "don't mess with success" keeps coming to mind. I'm afraid if I move them they'll die.   

As we learn, the fish train us well.....