I've had albinos before, had them to spawn, but can't just get the fry to survive in the first week. I've read a few articles, but would like to hear from someone who has successfully raised some.
Anyone wish to share some info on how to raise these delicate babies? Looking for a Kinda "Albino fry rearing 101" or "Albinos for dummies" kinda thing . 😁
Thanks
One of my pairs are producing albinos , but have not really done anything to attempt to raise the fry. So I would like to try and see what happens...
Quote from: Babers on April 24, 2018, 02:15:11 PM
One of my pairs are producing albinos , but have not really done anything to attempt to raise the fry. So I would like to try and see what happens...
..keep the light dim/dimmer during the early stages....
Thanks Jon. That's one suggestion I've read also. It says to keep the tank dim from eggs and keep it dim to a few weeks after freeswimming? Some say from wigglers. Idk.
I'm planning on doing this...feeding newly hatched bbs heavily, then removing excess food after they've all eaten. Feeding multiple times a day...3-4? Keeping the tank dim.
Any other suggestions??? Or am I overdoing it? huh
Seems like a lot of work.... ??? :o
Quote from: Babers on April 24, 2018, 08:28:11 PM
Thanks Jon. That's one suggestion I've read also. It says to keep the tank dim from eggs and keep it dim to a few weeks after freeswimming? Some say from wigglers. Idk.
I'm planning on doing this...feeding newly hatched bbs heavily, then removing excess food after they've all eaten. Feeding multiple times a day...3-4? Keeping the tank dim.
Any other suggestions??? Or am I overdoing it? huh
Seems like a lot of work.... ??? :o
....not over doing it...just taking precautions :).....you might find that vinegar eels or microworms work well early on....both stay alive in the water column longer.....and yes, too much light early can be the make/break issue...
When I tried albino PB's years ago it was a TOTAL disaster,thousands died without getting a single fish to survive,just couldn't get them to feed.
I did manage to raise a few non PBs.
I had much better luck with the albino dantums,maybe because they were stronger,i did things differently or a combination of things.
Here is how I did mine.
Moved them into a hang-on breeding box at free swimming,i used a marina 1.2 liter,the bigger size might work too for a large spawn.
I cut off the (top flaps) off of the cardboard box that the breeder came in,and slipped it up from the bottom so the only thing uncovered was the top of the breeder box.
Cut a piece of sponge for the breeder box overflow,so they don't get washed into the tank.
Don't use to course of a sponge or the fry might get stuck in it.
The marina box has a hole in the top,i run a line into the box with an air stone.
Position the stone on one END of the box,not to much flow,just enough to keep the BBS SUSPENDED in the box,rather then settling on the bottom.
Cover PART on the top of the box,leave the end WITH the stone uncovered so SOME light can get in.
I had a overhead light were mine were set up,so I left about 20% uncovered.
The fry seemed to move back and forth between the light and dark to feed,or at least had an option where they could see the BBS best.
As they grow I uncover more of the box.
I think the air stone is critical, keeps the BBS suspended,and the movement seems to attract them,or maybe the BBS is just hitting them in the head. ;D
I FLOOD them with BBS for the first few feedings,until you see that they are eating.
Make sure you remove excess BBS between feedings.
I turn OFF the overflow while i'm feeding,or the sponge might get plugged with the shrimp.
DON'T forget to turn it back on. ???
I use san fran (STRAIN) BBS,it's smaller and I think easier for them to handle.
Make sure you remove any excess between feedings.
Clean the box DAILY,if you don't there is an EXCELLENT chance they will end up with screwed up ventral,they like to hug the bottom.
I pour the fry into a bowl while the clean the box,then pour them back in and refill with tank water.
I leave them in the box for a couple weeks,and then moved them into a 10,a smaller tank would be better but that's all I have.
Again keeping the bottom spotless to avoid ventral problems.
Quote from: ghonk on April 25, 2018, 07:08:40 AM
When I tried albino PB's years ago it was a TOTAL disaster,thousands died without getting a single fish to survive,just couldn't get them to feed.
I did manage to raise a few non PBs.
I had much better luck with the albino dantums,maybe because they were stronger,i did things differently or a combination of things.
Here is how I did mine.
Moved them into a hang-on breeding box at free swimming,i used a marina 1.2 liter,the bigger size might work too for a large spawn.
I cut off the (top flaps) off of the cardboard box that the breeder came in,and slipped it up from the bottom so the only thing uncovered was the top of the breeder box.
Cut a piece of sponge for the breeder box overflow,so they don't get washed into the tank.
Don't use to course of a sponge or the fry might get stuck in it.
The marina box has a hole in the top,i run a line into the box with an air stone.
Position the stone on one END of the box,not to much flow,just enough to keep the BBS SUSPENDED in the box,rather then settling on the bottom.
Cover PART on the top of the box,leave the end WITH the stone uncovered so SOME light can get in.
I had a overhead light were mine were set up,so I left about 20% uncovered.
The fry seemed to move back and forth between the light and dark to feed,or at least had an option where they could see the BBS best.
As they grow I uncover more of the box.
I think the air stone is critical, keeps the BBS suspended,and the movement seems to attract them,or maybe the BBS is just hitting them in the head. ;D
I FLOOD them with BBS for the first few feedings,until you see that they are eating.
Make sure you remove excess BBS between feedings.
I turn OFF the overflow while i'm feeding,or the sponge might get plugged with the shrimp.
DON'T forget to turn it back on. ???
I use san fran (STRAIN) BBS,it's smaller and I think easier for them to handle.
Make sure you remove any excess between feedings.
Clean the box DAILY,if you don't there is an EXCELLENT chance they will end up with screwed up ventral,they like to hug the bottom.
I pour the fry into a bowl while the clean the box,then pour them back in and refill with tank water.
I leave them in the box for a couple weeks,and then moved them into a 10,a smaller tank would be better but that's all I have.
Again keeping the bottom spotless to avoid ventral problems.
...good advice imho..... |^|..good write up, Greg..... |^|
Thanks,how's that for overkill.LOL
It worked okay so I never changed the way I was doing it,although it was a LOT of work.
When I first start flooding them with BBS,there was always extra,so I had to pour them into a bowl after EVERY feeding.
And suck up the excess with a pipette,that part SUCKS. ;D
That is really a great write up. Great info. I can just imagine all the time you put into the dantums. Hope it works out for me as well. Thanks Greg.
Quote from: Mugwump on April 25, 2018, 07:14:02 AM
Quote from: ghonk on April 25, 2018, 07:08:40 AM
When I tried albino PB's years ago it was a TOTAL disaster,thousands died without getting a single fish to survive,just couldn't get them to feed.
I did manage to raise a few non PBs.
I had much better luck with the albino dantums,maybe because they were stronger,i did things differently or a combination of things.
Here is how I did mine.
Moved them into a hang-on breeding box at free swimming,i used a marina 1.2 liter,the bigger size might work too for a large spawn.
I cut off the (top flaps) off of the cardboard box that the breeder came in,and slipped it up from the bottom so the only thing uncovered was the top of the breeder box.
Cut a piece of sponge for the breeder box overflow,so they don't get washed into the tank.
Don't use to course of a sponge or the fry might get stuck in it.
The marina box has a hole in the top,i run a line into the box with an air stone.
Position the stone on one END of the box,not to much flow,just enough to keep the BBS SUSPENDED in the box,rather then settling on the bottom.
Cover PART on the top of the box,leave the end WITH the stone uncovered so SOME light can get in.
I had a overhead light were mine were set up,so I left about 20% uncovered.
The fry seemed to move back and forth between the light and dark to feed,or at least had an option where they could see the BBS best.
As they grow I uncover more of the box.
I think the air stone is critical, keeps the BBS suspended,and the movement seems to attract them,or maybe the BBS is just hitting them in the head. ;D
I FLOOD them with BBS for the first few feedings,until you see that they are eating.
Make sure you remove excess BBS between feedings.
I turn OFF the overflow while i'm feeding,or the sponge might get plugged with the shrimp.
DON'T forget to turn it back on. ???
I use san fran (STRAIN) BBS,it's smaller and I think easier for them to handle.
Make sure you remove any excess between feedings.
Clean the box DAILY,if you don't there is an EXCELLENT chance they will end up with screwed up ventral,they like to hug the bottom.
I pour the fry into a bowl while the clean the box,then pour them back in and refill with tank water.
I leave them in the box for a couple weeks,and then moved them into a 10,a smaller tank would be better but that's all I have.
Again keeping the bottom spotless to avoid ventral problems.
...good advice imho..... |^|..good write up, Greg..... |^|
That's great advice Greg. |^| |^| |^| |^| |^|
Thanks Joel and Willie.
Here is a vid with the setup,BEFORE I'm started using the cardboard box deal,at the time I was just draping some paper over the breeder box to cut out some light.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODiLEBLvevg
Here are the wigglers...3 days before freeswimming. I think I can see some albinos already :) I better get my rearing box ready...
Okay...these babies came from my Halfblack het pb pair. I didn't bother with the albinos before because I wanted to focus on producing the blue halfblack angels. But now that I've got those, it's time to see if I can produce albino halfblacks....
Quote from: Babers on April 30, 2018, 04:51:27 PM
Okay...these babies came from my Halfblack het pb pair. I didn't bother with the albinos before because I wanted to focus on producing the blue halfblack angels. But now that I've got those, it's time to see if I can produce albino halfblacks....
Albino half blacks.....HHmmmmm.....interesting trying to picture that....
How do you have them set up,are they feeding?
Quote from: Mugwump on April 30, 2018, 05:55:09 PM
Quote from: Babers on April 30, 2018, 04:51:27 PM
Okay...these babies came from my Halfblack het pb pair. I didn't bother with the albinos before because I wanted to focus on producing the blue halfblack angels. But now that I've got those, it's time to see if I can produce albino halfblacks....
Albino half blacks.....HHmmmmm.....interesting trying to picture that....
I remember hearing it can't be done,was a topic at TAF.
I saw a picture of Frank's so it is possible.
The back part will be reversed in color,like the stripes.
Quote from: ghonk on April 30, 2018, 05:55:52 PM
How do you have them set up,are they feeding?
Got them set up in a hang on breeding box also. Trying to feed them on how you did yours. You're right...it's a pain moving them out of the box to clean it. Hope the survive...
Quote from: Babers on April 30, 2018, 06:22:04 PM
Quote from: ghonk on April 30, 2018, 05:55:52 PM
How do you have them set up,are they feeding?
Got them set up in a hang on breeding box also. Trying to feed them on how you did yours. You're right...it's a pain moving them out of the box to clean it. Hope the survive...
..one of Steve's hatching jars might work better.......?
Once you have them feeding for a few days you might be able to move them to a SMALL tank,like a 2 1/2 if you have one.
But keep everything else the same,air stone in the CORNER,and lighting.
Should be MUCH easier to maintain,i didn't have that option since I only had 10's.
Are you using san fran strain BBS?
If not and they won't feed try it,i got mine from brine shrimp direct.
http://www.brineshrimpdirect.com/c2/san-francisco-strain-brine-shrimp-eggs-c24.html
Jon.....I left a couple albinos in with the non-albinos and they are in one of Steve's hatching jars. The potential problem I'm seeing this early is if the albinos are not fast enough to eat the bbs, it's just gonna go thru the foam huh I can put half of them in a jar though and see what happens. I do however plan on transferring them to those jars before they start growing their ventrals.
Greg...yes, I'm using SF bbs.
Break out the magnifying glass and look for orange tummies. ;D
Quote from: Babers on April 30, 2018, 06:42:07 PM
Jon.....I left a couple albinos in with the non-albinos and they are in one of Steve's hatching jars. The potential problem I'm seeing this early is if the albinos are not fast enough to eat the bbs, it's just gonna go thru the foam huh I can put half of them in a jar though and see what happens. I do however plan on transferring them to those jars before they start growing their ventrals.
Greg...yes, I'm using SF bbs.
....turn the air down when feeding..... ;)
Mine loved to hangout in the bubbles,i think it helped keep them off the bottom,which kept bacteria from attacking their ventrals and anal fins.
Quote from: ghonk on April 30, 2018, 06:52:07 PM
Mine loved to hangout in the bubbles,i think it helped keep them off the bottom,which kept bacteria from attacking their ventrals and anal fins.
....they're pretty weak sighted when that size...so food can be a hit or miss thing...riding bubbles takes that energy they need to grow......not enough food isn't a good thing.... huh
How are your albino marbles doing Jon,did you do anything special for them?
Quote from: Mugwump on April 30, 2018, 06:56:33 PM
Quote from: ghonk on April 30, 2018, 06:52:07 PM
Mine loved to hangout in the bubbles,i think it helped keep them off the bottom,which kept bacteria from attacking their ventrals and anal fins.
....they're pretty weak sighted when that size...so food can be a hit or miss thing...riding bubbles takes that energy they need to grow......not enough food isn't a good thing.... huh
They also seemed to feed in/near the current.
It's possible that the movement of the shrimp attracted them,or maybe it was just hitting them in the head. ;)
No doubt you can over do it with the air,you don't want it to heavy,just enough to keep the bbs moving.
Here are the albinos...resolution is terrible because of low light. Their still flooded with bbs...you can pretty much differentiate the non -albinos based on their dark eyes. 3 days freeswimming at this time.
How are they doing Joel?
They're still good. I've removed the foam/filter on the drain part of the Breeding box and just kept the plastic grill. The fry are big enough that they will not go thru it anymore.
Here they are at 7 day freeswimming...
https://youtu.be/fhgVPPoGsCY
Quote from: Babers on May 02, 2018, 09:18:36 PM
They're still good. I've removed the foam/filter on the drain part of the Breeding box and just kept the plastic grill. The fry are big enough that they will not go thru it anymore.
They are looking really good. Congrats. |^| |^| |^|
Thanks Willie.
You have it made now,getting them to START feeding is the hardest part.
Keep the box EXTRA clean,to avoid bad ventrals.
I raised a batch of about 35 to near pea size before excepting they were going to have NO ventrals.
Ton of work wasted,only to pitch them.
I'm increasing light exposure day by day so their sensitive eyes gets used to it. No problem eating. I'm trying to balance the light/dim so they don't stay at bottom of tank. Trying to keep the tank as clean as I can too. Thanks again Greg. :)
Albinos are now in their own tank. Eating good. Still has sensitivity to too much light but they can see good with ambient light coming from ceiling. Ventrals are starting to come out. They are staying away from the tank bottom...like I asked them too, lol.
Quote from: Babers on May 08, 2018, 08:34:03 AM
Albinos are now in their own tank. Eating good. Still has sensitivity to too much light but they can see good with ambient light coming from ceiling. Ventrals are starting to come out. They are staying away from the tank bottom...like I asked them too, lol.
..excellent !
I have a batch of Albino Dantum that will go free swimming in a couple of days. I've been unsuccessful raising albino in the past so any tips are appreciated. I have them i an angelsplus fry rearing jar, and when it's time to feed I lower the water in the jar so there's only about 1/2'' above the sponge and feed a mixture of bbs, microworms, spirulina powder and a small amount of hard boiled egg yolk. I also cover the jar mostly so it's not too bright. The stupid fry just won't seem to eat....they bounce around like they're eating but never get full bellies and after a few days just die off.
Quote from: pwsusi on May 08, 2018, 04:49:14 PM
I have a batch of Albino Dantum that will go free swimming in a couple of days. I've been unsuccessful raising albino in the past so any tips are appreciated. I have them i an angelsplus fry rearing jar, and when it's time to feed I lower the water in the jar so there's only about 1/2'' above the sponge and feed a mixture of bbs, microworms, spirulina powder and a small amount of hard boiled egg yolk. I also cover the jar mostly so it's not too bright. The stupid fry just won't seem to eat....they bounce around like they're eating but never get full bellies and after a few days just die off.
I've always liked the 2 1/2's....easier to keep clean....early on just cut the air and feed.....I've never mixed a food cocktail either....just one type food per feeding....as far as the egg yolk stuff....?....
I refuse to use it.....way too messy and hard to clean up.....small early hatched bbs usually does it....and you can really see if they're eating, or not.....I like micro worms too....they survive longer in the water column that other food.......if using an air stone?...instead try the small stick to the side sponges......much easier water movement, and doesn't roll the bottom water like the stones....plus the sponge attracts the uneaten food that they like to forage on.......you can cycle that mini sponge in a day..using another tank....even keep fresh sponges going to just swap out during changes.........the water will remain very fresh with less parameter swings at water change time because your tank will be cycled and stable....happy fry.....
...don't be Dr House...... ;D......steady as she goes Capt'n... |^|
Quote from: Mugwump on May 08, 2018, 05:05:50 PM
.instead try the small stick to the side sponges......much easier water movement, and doesn't roll the bottom water like the stones....plus the sponge attracts the uneaten food that they like to forage on.......
Which stick to the side sponges would that be? I have cut some matten filters for my 2-1/2s and they seem to work pretty good. Always open to new ideas.
Quote from: waterboy on May 08, 2018, 05:34:12 PM
Quote from: Mugwump on May 08, 2018, 05:05:50 PM
.instead try the small stick to the side sponges......much easier water movement, and doesn't roll the bottom water like the stones....plus the sponge attracts the uneaten food that they like to forage on.......
Which stick to the side sponges would that be? I have cut some matten filters for my 2-1/2s and they seem to work pretty good. Always open to new ideas.
..something like this... http://www.kensfish.com/aquarium-supplies/aquarium-filters/elite-single-sponge-filter.html (http://www.kensfish.com/aquarium-supplies/aquarium-filters/elite-single-sponge-filter.html)
or like mine's like this except a single.......http://discususa.com/epages/837c2f23-61ea-4645-82f2-3b56290a54a4.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/837c2f23-61ea-4645-82f2-3b56290a54a4/Products/%22double%20sponge%20filter%20for%20grow%20out%20tanks.%22/SubProducts/%22double%20sponge%20filter%20for%20grow%20out%20tanks.-0001%22 (http://discususa.com/epages/837c2f23-61ea-4645-82f2-3b56290a54a4.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/837c2f23-61ea-4645-82f2-3b56290a54a4/Products/%22double%20sponge%20filter%20for%20grow%20out%20tanks.%22/SubProducts/%22double%20sponge%20filter%20for%20grow%20out%20tanks.-0001%22)
..they're only a few inches tall....whole fixture
Hi Paul...I just basically followed Greg's Set up. I use a breeding box and hang it on the side of a 10 gal tank. I flood them with bbs when feeding and leave the bbs for an hour with a little air coming from an airstone. After an hour, I turn the air back on the breeder tank and let that clear as much bbs out of the Breeder tank. After another half an hour, I clean what's left. I do water changes daily on the 10 gal tank. I've got some non albino fry in the 10 gal tank that will eat the excess bbs (no waste of food 🙂). I only use ambient lighting and cover the top. I feed 4 times a day on the first few days, so if they didn't get to eat much from previous feeding, they can eat more.
I didn't use the angelsplus jar because the fry are not fast enough to find and eat the bbs in the first few days (I'm not worried about the ventrals yet in the first week anyway). The bbs will just go through the pores of the foam and not get eaten. I was gonna use the jar after a week, but seems like they're big enough to handle their own tank....as long as you keep the lighting balance, so the fry won't settle at the bottom of the tank.
Approx 90% of the albino fry I separated made it by doing this method. This is what worked for me. Hope it helps.
Quote from: Babers on May 08, 2018, 08:21:41 PM
Hi Paul...I just basically followed Greg's Set up. I use a breeding box and hang it on the side of a 10 gal tank. I flood them with bbs when feeding and leave the bbs for an hour with a little air coming from an airstone. After an hour, I turn the air back on the breeder tank and let that clear as much bbs out of the Breeder tank. After another half an hour, I clean what's left. I do water changes daily on the 10 gal tank. I've got some non albino fry in the 10 gal tank that will eat the excess bbs (no waste of food 🙂). I only use ambient lighting and cover the top. I feed 4 times a day on the first few days, so if they didn't get to eat much from previous feeding, they can eat more.
I didn't use the angelsplus jar because the fry are not fast enough to find and eat the bbs in the first few days (I'm not worried about the ventrals yet in the first week anyway). The bbs will just go through the pores of the foam and not get eaten. I was gonna use the jar after a week, but seems like they're big enough to handle their own tank....as long as you keep the lighting balance, so the fry won't settle at the bottom of the tank.
Approx 90% of the albino fry I separated made it by doing this method. This is what worked for me. Hope it helps.
..nice job.....sounds like you'll get a decent batch.... |^|
Frank's albino HB.
...'het' half black more than likely.....
Paul, Greg, Dale...Joel, have you tried green water ?
I like to drink fresh myself. If you mean used it for something else, no I have never used it for anything.
Quote from: waterboy on May 09, 2018, 03:12:00 PM
I like to drink fresh myself. If you mean used it for something else, no I have never used it for anything.
..I seem to remember Ed using it on some fry....albinos?....
Quote from: Mugwump on May 09, 2018, 02:57:23 PM
Paul, Greg, Dale...Joel, have you tried green water ?
No not me.
I've never used it also to raise fry
..did you get any survivors at all, Paul ?