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How long before it's us?

Started by BallAquatics, July 07, 2015, 02:18:34 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Mugwump

Quote from: LizStreithorst on September 26, 2015, 02:29:08 PM
The Pope is a wonderful man.  He helped the liberals more than the conservatives in his address to congress.  Y'all may think differently about him after his talk to the World Meeting of Families later today.  He has said out loud that he is not a leftist.

I have no issue with the subject of any of his speeches. He's not political in his talks. He's merely trying to tell us all to wake up.
Jon

?Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming ?Wow! What a Ride!? ~ Hunter S. Thompson

GraphicGr8s

There is no such thing as MTS.
West coast of the east coast of North America
Personal Image Management Professional
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives.
There are only two types of people. Italians and those that wish they were

Mugwump

Quote from: GraphicGr8s on September 27, 2015, 12:57:13 PM
874


OH NO, GRAPHS !!!!....AAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh     
Jon

?Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming ?Wow! What a Ride!? ~ Hunter S. Thompson

BillT

Quote from: GraphicGr8s on September 27, 2015, 12:57:13 PM
874

You don't really know what these graphs mean do you graphic?
Else you could at least summarize them.

If you do understand them, than you probably realize that several of them are visually deceptive because they do not have a Y-axis zero, thus presenting a distorted view of reality.
Maybe you should read "How to Lie with Statistics".

GraphicGr8s

Quote from: BillT on September 27, 2015, 01:51:40 PM
Quote from: GraphicGr8s on September 27, 2015, 12:57:13 PM
874

You don't really know what these graphs mean do you graphic?
Else you could at least summarize them.

If you do understand them, than you probably realize that several of them are visually deceptive because they do not have a Y-axis zero, thus presenting a distorted view of reality.
Maybe you should read "How to Lie with Statistics".

Bill if you understood graphs you would see you truly don't need a Y-axis zero. While some do have it these are trending graphs. And all the trends with the current occupant in the White House are not good. I fully realize I am not proficient with how to lie with statistics. That's the liberal's forte. In fact it seems they wrote the book.

You can go research for yourself what a trending graph is.
There is no such thing as MTS.
West coast of the east coast of North America
Personal Image Management Professional
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives.
There are only two types of people. Italians and those that wish they were

BillT

Trend graphs are visually deceptive because they remove any sense of proportion. You could take any vanishingly small change in some number and make it look as big (or small) as you want.
Its something businesses do a lot to get your money (or politicians do to get your vote). 
Guess you swallowed another one! Yum.

"How to lie with statistics" (http://www.amazon.com/How-Lie-Statistics-Darrell-Huff/dp/0393310728) is a classic little book (first published in 1954) about how people abuse statistics and the display of data and how to recognize it. Its short and cheap. I read it when I was in Jr. High school. You could probably get through it too.
Its mental self dense. something you could use. Seriously dude.

I guess this what happens when cherry picking alone needs an assist.


QuoteThat's the liberal's forte.
How come you are using one from one of you wingnut websites?
Does that mean you and your website are liberals? Hope not.

GraphicGr8s

Quote from: BillT on September 27, 2015, 01:51:40 PM
Quote from: GraphicGr8s on September 27, 2015, 12:57:13 PM
874

You don't really know what these graphs mean do you graphic?
Else you could at least summarize them.

If you do understand them, than you probably realize that several of them are visually deceptive because they do not have a Y-axis zero, thus presenting a distorted view of reality.
Maybe you should read "How to Lie with Statistics".
Bill, which ones do you consider "visually deceptive"?
There is no such thing as MTS.
West coast of the east coast of North America
Personal Image Management Professional
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives.
There are only two types of people. Italians and those that wish they were

BillT

Two thirds of them, based on what I already said.

I am surprised you could not figure it out yourself.

I would also question data choices, considering the source and the poor legibility.
This is not worthy of much consideration.

GraphicGr8s

Quote from: BillT on September 28, 2015, 11:31:11 AM
Two thirds of them, based on what I already said.

I am surprised you could not figure it out yourself.

I would also question data choices, considering the source and the poor legibility.
This is not worthy of much consideration.
Well Bill they are government sources and if you did not in fact trust the data you could verify it. And in all but one chart we have at least 6 years of data.

So let's explain a couple of the graphs Bill.

Food stamps. While there were ups and downs on the dollars spent on the program since 1968 (give or take a year or two) It has, since 2007 skyrocketed. Up until that time it was below $30b and now stands at about $75b. Trend seems obvious and even if we had no 0 Y axis should be pretty self evident.

Federal Debt as a percentage of the GDP. In 1981 it was at $30% of GDP. Now it's over 100%.

https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/GFDEGDQ188S

Labor Force participation. Currently stands at 62.6%
Bill, that means that 37.4% of those that could be working have dropped off the roles and are not counted in unemployment.

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS11300000

Median Income. Hey it's down. Quite a bit.
https://www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/data/statemedian/

Home Ownership? Yep. It's down also

http://www.census.gov/housing/hvs/files/qtr215/hown215.png

Rentals? Same

http://www.census.gov/housing/hvs/files/qtr215/rvr215.png

Bill more data here.
http://www.census.gov/housing/hvs/index.html

Federal debt?  Well that should be a given that it has gone up.
But here is a real time clock

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

There is no such thing as MTS.
West coast of the east coast of North America
Personal Image Management Professional
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives.
There are only two types of people. Italians and those that wish they were

BillT

QuoteWell Bill they are government sources and if you did not in fact trust the data you could verify it. And in all but one chart we have at least 6 years of data.

If you don't understand that you can just grab a bit of data and make a graph to show some particular point, your part of the problem.
As I said before I no longer think your sources are worth the time to go look at them. Your credibility is shot.

I have wasted enough time on that already.
I've got more important things to do. I'm taking out a different kind of garbage.

GraphicGr8s

#430
Quote from: BillT on September 28, 2015, 01:17:48 PM
QuoteWell Bill they are government sources and if you did not in fact trust the data you could verify it. And in all but one chart we have at least 6 years of data.

If you don't understand that you can just grab a bit of data and make a graph to show some particular point, your part of the problem.
As I said before I no longer think your sources are worth the time to go look at them. Your credibility is shot.

I have wasted enough time on that already.
I've got more important things to do. I'm taking out a different kind of garbage.

Bill, these are the GOVERNMENT's own graphs not mine. Not some "conservative's. These are the government who you seem to love and trust. But now you don't trust them. So which is it Bill? Do you trust the government data and charts or not? And if not then how can you trust them on anything else if they can grab some data and make up charts? How can you trust them on "Global Warming" Bill? Or do you pick and chose what you want to believe depending on whether or not it goes along with your brainwashing? Well Bill which is it? Do we trust government data or not?

But like you said, you can just grab some data and make up graphs etc. Pretty much what they do with climate change.

Some more Kool Aid Bill?
There is no such thing as MTS.
West coast of the east coast of North America
Personal Image Management Professional
There are very few personal problems that cannot be solved through a suitable application of high explosives.
There are only two types of people. Italians and those that wish they were

LizStreithorst

Food stamps and unemployment are up because minimum wage is not a living wage.  The middle class is disappearing.  I work.  I used to be middle, now I'm lucky if I'm lower middle.  It isn't the same for working folks now as it was in the 60's.

The other stuff, I don't know about.  I know that Clinton lucked out being president when the tech boom was going on.  It might explain some graph.
Always move forward. Never look back.

Mugwump

Quote from: LizStreithorst on September 28, 2015, 02:40:40 PM
Food stamps and unemployment are up because minimum wage is not a living wage.  The middle class is disappearing.  I work.  I used to be middle, now I'm lucky if I'm lower middle.  It isn't the same for working folks now as it was in the 60's.

The other stuff, I don't know about.  I know that Clinton lucked out being president when the tech boom was going on.  It might explain some graph.

I'm not sure 'G' has figured that out yet, Liz. ....and don't forget retired folks....the 'boomers' aren't all rich folks either, and while SS helps, but is not enough...
Jon

?Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming ?Wow! What a Ride!? ~ Hunter S. Thompson

LizStreithorst

Always move forward. Never look back.

BillT

QuoteBill, these are the GOVERNMENT's own graphs not mine. Not some "conservative's. These are the government who you seem to love and trust. But now you don't trust them. So which is it Bill? Do you trust the government data and charts or not? And if not then how can you trust them on anything else if they can grab some data and make up charts? How can you trust them on "Global Warming" Bill? Or do you pick and chose what you want to believe depending on whether or not it goes along with your brainwashing? Well Bill which is it? Do we trust government data or not?

Blah, blah, blah ...